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Pay below US Federal minimum wage laws!!!!

Just wondering if it concerns odesk that there are several jobs which pay hourly and are paying below the federal minimum wage laws. Now I am no expert in law but isn't this illegal. I am speaking specifically about jobs that are being offered from members located within the United States to people accepting these jobs from within the US.

 

Yes for me I would never accept any of these positions since there has never been a time in my life where I got paid as low as a few of the positions I have just looked at within the site.

 

Vote Result

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Score: 8.8, Votes: 9
Doesn't apply here ....

There are 2 reasons the US minimum wage law does not apply here.

1) This law does NOT apply to firms outside the US, nor to workers outside the US.

2) Unlike the British law, this law has NEVER applied to sefl-employed contract workers. 

 

That means we are competing in an international market, not a domestic market.

 

Well, yes and no

The original post addressed American employers in the US offering jobs for under the minimum wage.

The answer about "contract workers" is valid only if the workers are in fact independent contractors. However, an independent contractor, by definition, gets paid for his or her work product, not for his or her time. If the person paying the bill wants me to be at my desk from 9:00 AM until 5:00 PM, and insists on a screenshot and camera snap to verify it, I'm no longer an independent contractor, I'm an employee - and employees by law get paid minimum wage, even if the transaction goes through a third party. For all those who smugly answer about contractors not being subject to wage and hour laws, have you ever considered that temp agencies pay their people at least minimum wage, and withhold taxes, etc? If what some of these people are saying about contractors were in fact true, employers would simply reclassify the people who work for them as independent contractors, slash their pay and stop paying FICA and Medicare contributions.

I've dealt with many bosses who thought they could be slick by classifying workers as independent contractors and saving payroll taxes and the cost of benefits. I've usually had to sit them down with a lawyer to explain that for relatively minor savings, they're exposing themselves to a world of expensive litigation.

I'm not aware of any provision that permits someone to work as an employee for less than minimum wage, even if they agree to be paid less. And a very basic rule of thumb is that if you're paying someone for their time, they're an employee. If you're paying them for their work product, like code, or website content, or paving your driveway, they can be an independent contractor.

Why would you want

Why would you want to be an employee? They'll flatten your salary to a miniscule amount and double your workload to pay for the overhead!? Just asking.

hellooo!

The original post is also 5 YEARS OLD!

Uhhh

Quote:
I've dealt with many bosses who thought they could be slick by classifying workers as independent contractors and saving payroll taxes and the cost of benefits. I've usually had to sit them down with a lawyer

I guess this is why you decided to try freelancing?

Does not apply

CARLOS B. wrote:

Just wondering if it concerns odesk that there are several jobs which pay hourly and are paying below the federal minimum wage laws. Now I am no expert in law but isn't this illegal. I am speaking specifically about jobs that are being offered from members located within the United States to people accepting these jobs from within the US.

Yes for me I would never accept any of these positions since there has never been a time in my life where I got paid as low as a few of the positions I have just looked at within the site.

Every time I answer one of these questions others think I work at oDesk.  I do not - so with that out of the way, here's some info:

Federal and State laws in the US that apply to EMPLOYEES do not extend to freelancers/independent contractors.

Here's a helpful link to some info that is a good 'rule of thumb' regarding employee/freelance status.  Since you're the 'boss' it's up to you to pay you minimum wage - not up to those who contract with you to ensure you're being paid minimum wage.

http://employment.findlaw.com/employment/employment-employee-more-topics/employment-employee-independent-contractor-top/employment-employee-independent-contractor-pro-con.html

Doreen

Minimum Wage Again!!!

I've notice the topic about minimum wage always kept this forum alive with never-ending debate! Oftentimes, somebody from US would start a spark on this topic!

We are on a global competitive market. Most jobs that I see myself are from US. Many providers that I have met and have competed with the job openings are from India. I have also seen many US providers too and they can command a higher rate and get the job. It must be something to do with the little time difference of the buyer and the provider. That is the distinct advantage that US providers can have over their providers from the other part of the world - being able to collaborate with each other without one party sacrificing sleep!

It's not that India cannot be able to make their prices high. But everything here certainly has to do with global economics on the standard of living. Many buyers realize that they can get cheaper services in India and still get same quality results as that which came from US.

Actually it's more interesting than that!!

Gemma B. wrote:

I've notice the topic about minimum wage always kept this forum alive with never-ending debate! Oftentimes, somebody from US would start a spark on this topic!

I think what I find most interesting is if you follow the links to these folks profiles that keep bringing this topic up they are all providers who have invitably been part of the oDesk community less that two weeks. These are the folks who seem to feel they are entitled to earn a specific wage just because the 'are'. 

I'ts incredible.  I am guessing that a great deal of these folks have (a) only worked in local markets (b) don't believe that to succeed as a freelancer you need to develop a 'new' reputation or (c) have really no clue what global markets mean.

But, you are correct: 99.9% of the 'complainers' are from the US.  All I can say is if they don't feel equipped to deal with a global market where they can't make 60 or 70 dollars an hour they should seriously consider working locally and seeing what their skills will get them in terms of wages.

yes again

I disagree about the quality of work being the same. One that works for a lower rate will not go above and beyond or double check the completed work is up to high quality standards. I just do not agree with providers that are in the U.S having the ability to ask for an hourly rate that is lower than the rate for an individual working for McDonald's.

Here I have to disagree,

Here I have to disagree, There are worker in India, Philippines and other "Developing Countries" who are good if not better. Problem is there are workers who does not know how to price themselves in the global market. " The lower rate vis a vis the dollar" is the normal rate they have been used to accepting in their locale short of being exploited. And most importantly the character of the worker, how they work, having the mentality of "Working to get paid and not paid to work". I had help alot of this type of workers. By exposing them on how much their skills and working habits are really worth.

Why do you dig up topics that have been dead for years?

?
What IS the point of randomly replying to a topic that's beed dead and buried?

The Point is...

The point is, there is none... realized I made a bobo only after I press the save button.. Was looking for a way to delete can't find it. was just hoping nobody noticed it too... how s...d of me... ;0(

Whoops

1. When I posted my reply, I also didn't notice that the original post was 5 years old. Sorry.

2. I was never concerned with non-US clients paying less than the minimum wage to US contractors, or US clients paying less than MW to non-US contractors. My only concern was US firms paying US contractors on an hourly basis at less than the minimum wage.

3. Someone kindly posted a link to a findlaw page that's now dead. Here's a link to a posting on the topic that works, at least today: http://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/right-minimum-wage-32961.html. According to this, freelancers and independent contractors are exempt from wage and hour laws.

I've still got my doubts about the validity of an individual working on an hourly basis being considered a contractor, considering the IRS tests for employee v contractor, but I don't think that's a discussion that should take place here.

If oDesk could close this thread, that'd be helpful.

Thanks, and take good care.

Dale M.