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Is odesk suppressing resumes

I have noticed that the jobs I have posted recently are not getting
as many applications as they used too.
in the past I could post an hourly job and within 2 hours I would have 200 applications and often it would be 400+. Now I am getting 30-40 applications for hourly jobs and the same fraction for fixed price jobs.

Now I know their are 2 possible reasons.
The contractors have all of a sudden become really smart, they have formed a union
and they all agree not too submit resumes to every single job in order to raise the rates.

or b)
Odesk has come too the understanding that the fewer people that apply for the job
the more a person will make, and the more the contractor makes, the more odesk makes.
We will call this the supply and demand theory of the game.

Vote Result

++--------
Score: 2.2, Votes: 15
Doubtful.

Rachelle S. wrote:
I have noticed that the jobs I have posted recently are not getting
as many applications as they used too.
in the past I could post an hourly job and within 2 hours I would have 200 applications and often it would be 400+. Now I am getting 30-40 applications for hourly jobs and the same fraction for fixed price jobs.

Now I know their are 2 possible reasons.
The contractors have all of a sudden become really smart, they have formed a union
and they all agree not too submit resumes to every single job in order to raise the rates.

or b)
Odesk has come too the understanding that the fewer people that apply for the job
the more a person will make, and the more the contractor makes, the more odesk makes.
We will call this the supply and demand theory of the game.

a) There are still a lot of not-so-bright contractors out there who apply for those $1 -$5 an hour jobs. There is no union.

b) Its not logical that any company based on this premise would stop anyone from applying to anything. Get real.

The most likely scenario is that at least some of the people that would have applied to your jobs earlier have other commitments. Its also entirely logical that some of those people have stopped applying for those $1 -$5 an hour jobs.

Raise your rates and see what happens.

Cate, First off your

Cate,
First off your range is too narrow. I get people applying from .10 cents to $20.00 an hour.

b) It is very logical that odesk would want too stop people from applying
as on a $20.00 fee they get $2.00, while on 20 cent fee they get .02 cents.
seems logical too me.

I dont need to raise the rates, as i still get what i want, however
where I was able too in the past choose from 200 people now i can choose from 30
I recently had a data entry project, was able to find 5 people who did a fine job for .50 cents an hour. But you are also correct, perhaps people have other jobs. At the same time
perhaps its because the job i have posted recently has too do with a skill and is not writing articles. Maybe thats the reason.

Ug, where to begin

never mind.

This is just too crazy.

"logical" ......

Rachelle S. wrote:
Cate,

b) It is very logical that odesk would want too stop people from applying
as on a $20.00 fee they get $2.00, while on 20 cent fee they get .02 cents.
seems logical too me. .

Just as well oDesk work out the fees for you.......

Laughing out loud

Tell me, if you can find the monkeys you want for the peanuts you pay, what, exactly are you complaining about?

I hardly would call them

I hardly would call them monkeys.
I am not complaining but here is my issue.

If I was a brad new client with Odesk. If I would have submited a job
I would have gotton resumes for $3.00 and up per hour. Being brand new I might think that those are low rates. I would then accept that rate and higher that person. Not knowing that I could get the job done for a lot less money.

Lucky for me, I do know the market and so I know if I wait just a little bit longer I will find the person whom I want too work with at a price that is agreeable to both of us.

amazing

Rachelle S. wrote:

perhaps its because the job i have posted recently has too do with a skill and is not writing articles. Maybe thats the reason.

Writing is a skill, silly of you to think otherwise, unless you call any submission writing, which my dear sir, does not always qualify as "writing".

Heather.....

Heather H. wrote:
Rachelle S. wrote:

perhaps its because the job i have posted recently has too do with a skill and is not writing articles. Maybe thats the reason.

Writing is a skill, silly of you to think otherwise, unless you call any submission writing, which my dear sir, does not always qualify as "writing".

Always consider the source. Of course someone who does not understand the difference between "too" and "to" or when to use "there" and "their" - or work out 10% of $ 0.20 won't appreciate "writing" as a "skill....."

I'm not sure somebody willing

I'm not sure somebody willing to pay 50 cents/hour will have had much experience with skills in any category.

Sure....

Rachelle S. wrote:

perhaps its because the job i have posted recently has too do with a skill and is not writing articles. Maybe thats the reason.

Because your ability to "skillfully" write your own stuff is so evident here. I'm sure with all your innate writing ability you're quite able to distinguish between the $0.50 an hour writers and the $50 an hour ones and only pick the best. (please note the sarcasm)

Laughing out loud

Cate My writing skills are

Cate
My writing skills are horrible. However even I can tell the difference between the .50 cent writers and the fifty dollar writer. I can even tell the differnce between a 50 cents writer and twenty five dollar writer. Where I start to have more trouble is finding the differnce between the $1.00 writer and the $2.50 writer or the twenty five dollar vs the fifty dollar writer.

The reason for this once you get too the twenty five dollar range they have long passed my ability to judge them. However too combat my lack of skills in the writing area, I would hire a proven editor or two and I would pay them in the range of $15-25.00 an hour i would then submit the work of the various writers and they would then tell me which writers were worth the money and which ones are not. It is true this is not full proof
however it was the best idea that I could come up with, and if you had another suggestion I would be glad to hear it.

Just to be clear,

Let me get this straight. You're hiring an editor at $15-$25 an hour to judge the work of writers that you paid $1-2.50 an hour for? And you're doing this to save money, instead of just hiring quality writers to begin with?

I don't understand this business methodology. It seems pretty crazy to me.

Here is the answer. I

Here is the answer.
I never said i am paying $1.00 per hour for article writing
I was paying $1.00 per article of 500 words.

The hourly rate I was talking about was for a data entry task. Which is totaly seperate job.

this is a friendly conversation

Can I just ask you, then, how you define the word "exploitation?"

I truly am curious.

Does it matter how I define

Does it matter how I define it.
However I would say that typical exploitation takes place when party has the upper hand over another party. So for example If I was able to force people too work for me with out being payed and if they dont they would be hurt. This is exploitation or a better word slavery.
However in this case its two people who come together too an agreement. They dont have too accept the offer, and I dont have to make the offer. You might not like the detail however people do have the right too make their own choices.

Slavery vs exploitation

I would agree that there is not a lot of difference between slavery and exploitation, but they are different.

You describe slavery.

Exploitation is where one party holds a clear advantage over the other and gains as much from that advantage as possible.

Rachelle S. wrote:
at a price that is agreeable to both of us.

I think you assume too much about what is agreeable. Of course someone who is desperate enough to work for $1-2.50 an hour/article will be more than happy with the opportunity to work, but it is exploitation to pay such wages to people who deserve fair market value. Doing so holds them in their state of desperation, just to get ahead yourself. That is exploitation.

It does matter.....

Rachelle,

I too am a terrible writer, that is why I don't do writing jobs or publishing works. But let me just understand your business model. Making it simple, you hire a bunch of writers (from asian countries I would supposed), have them work and submit to you 500 word article. Then your editor checks the articles for grammar, spelling and maybe content, and you will pay $1 to those who will pass your editor only, am I correct so far? True there are and will be pseudo writers claiming that they are, even though they are not.

But my problem is, the so called most of not all the "GEMs" in writing are not aware or familiar how much their skills are worth in the global market. These are contractors/workers who are only used to and expose in their local market in which case the rate they have been used to receiving and local industry standard are really low.

And I am sure you are aware and familiar of global standard and market, thus in your case you are taking ADVANTAGE of the "GEMS" by paying them way below what they are worth. Your contention is that they "AGREED", since they know no better how much they are worth, and you know how much they should be worth, by paying them lower your taking "ADVANTAGE" of their "GULLIBILITY". And when you take advantage of someone it is called "EXPLOITATION".

Let me ask you this, setting aside all those who agreed to your rates. If you are a "GOOD WRITER" how much would you think your rate be? or better yet Just being you, your "Expertise" are comfortable paying someone 90% lower than what you should be receiving?

Remember NIKE? How they almost got into trouble when someone exposed the appalling working condition and ridiculous low pay they are giving the Chinese workers who produces their $100-150 "QUALITY" shoes? And these Chinese they employ are good workers and agreed to the pay. I guess you follow the saying " If there are no Takers there won't be any Exploiters" And since there are many takers......

BTW, you should have someone to check on your EDITORS, they maybe just taking Advantage of you. How sure are you that the articles they say are good are really good at all? ( You said that you are a terrible writer, would you know any better?) ummmm just saying...

You're wasting money.

Rachelle S. wrote:
Here is the answer.
I never said i am paying $1.00 per hour for article writing
I was paying $1.00 per article of 500 words.

The hourly rate I was talking about was for a data entry task. Which is totaly seperate job.

Instead of spending $1 an article for an "artical writter," then adding in a $25-$30 an hour editor on top of that, why not just spend $25 an article for a writer that is good enough not to need an editor? -- and there are plenty of us on this site.

Any good editor is going to take at least 45 minutes to an hour to rewrite the drivel that's being sold to you for $1.

This is not good business sense at all. You really should rethink your model.

I know, right

Cate B. wrote:
Any good editor is going to take at least 45 minutes to an hour to rewrite the drivel that's being sold to you for $1.

It takes a large amount of focus to make trash smell sweet. "Writters" who work for those wages have no pride invested in the work. They just want one article done so they can get to the next one. The outcome is truly trash. Trash that someone pays for (OP in this instance), and then pays again to have someone else try to make it appear decent.

This really makes no sense.

Cate Why are you assuming

Cate
Why are you assuming that I have the editor rewrite the article.

How long does it take for you too read an article and decide if it reaches a minimum standard or not. Say 1 min, maybe 2.

Now lets say I can get $2.00 per article I am using low numbers
now lets say I get 30 articles done by 30 differnt people.

Now the editor reads them and accepts 15 and rejects 15.
So my costs are

$25.00 for the editor and $15.00 for the articles
which is $40.00

I the use them to make $2.00 per article and that is $30.0
(now as i said the $2.00 is low as in the 15 often their are gems)

Now the next round of articles I will have 15 articles and each article say makes $2.00 but i no longer need the editor so now thats $30.00

Then after awhile i also need to have some top writers who get paid a higher amount, so we will at some point take the 15 writers and the editor will then look at their work and decide which one are the top. So that would be 3 writers. (just using this as a number)

now i did mention that i paid $15-$25 per hour. So now that writer article will be sent to the $15.00 editor, who will correct the writing and fix any errors and make improvements. Th result are sent back the writer. Now of course those article also bring in more money for me.

Those writers who have gone through all this exploition as some people have called it are now working for others making around $15-20 per article. Furthermore they will often refer their friends and family too me.

You're being scammed.

Rachelle S. wrote:
Cate
Why are you assuming that I have the editor rewrite the article.

Well, excuse me if I made an assumption that anyone who has ever actually worked as an editor would make.

I made that assumption because as a writer/editor I have seen what you get for paying $2 for 500-words and it is nothing I would expect my clients to accept. Any editor who tells you that kind of writing doesn't typically need to be either partially or totally rewritten is not doing his/her job -- and you don't know enough about what you're doing to see that.

I suspect you're one of those clients who thinks that a bunch of SEO-driven stuff is what is making you money. I could be wrong, but I doubt it. Since Panda and Penguin have proven that is no longer the case -- Google readership is expecting websites to provide optimal content with expert writing -- you might not be rolling in the "big bucks" too much longer.

Good luck to you. Continue letting yourself be scammed and pass that on to your writers with your exploitative wages. You seem to have an answer for everything...and with your strong grasp of what you only think you know, I see no reason to continue this conversation any longer.

Cate You are correct the

Cate

You are correct the latest google update has taken its toll. Their is no doubt about it.

You publish $2 UNEDITED articles?

I knew I hated internet articles for a reason. Do you realize how obvious these hack jobs are when a person with even minimal intelligence lands on them?

Rachelle S. wrote:
i no longer need the editor

Your editor doesn't even edit? Shock
Oh snap, these pieces have to be real gems.

Rachelle S. wrote:
the editor will then look at their work and decide which one are the top

The top writers at $2 per article? Has to be stiff competition. How does the editor ever decide?

Rachelle S. wrote:
now i did mention that i paid $15-$25 per hour.

You said you paid this for an editor. Who here is going to believe you hand out ten fold raises?

Rachelle S. wrote:
So now that writer article will be sent to the $15.00 editor, who will correct the writing and fix any errors and make improvements. Th result are sent back the writer. Now of course those article also bring in more money for me.

A proper business model with a good outcome for all. You don't like receiving that higher return from the get go, on all of your submissions? Seems to me it is a better way to build a brand and protect your reputation.

Rachelle S. wrote:
exploition as some people have called it

Who me? Surely you are not referring to me here? I would never call it that. I would call it exploitation. I would also encourage you to listen to those who keep pointing out how badly you need an editor.

Rachelle S. wrote:
are now working for others making around $15-20 per article.

Because it is closer to what they deserved before dealing with all this. Of course they send their friends and family your way. It is good.

When did I say I gave 10 fold

When did I say I gave 10 fold raises?
I never said that. The top pay for the writer is maybe $5.00 for a 500 word article.

I dont need an editor. I do not publish any of my own work.
No very few of the articles are gems. Do you really think your going to get a lot of gems when your paying $1.00 per article.

I think you have too high expectations of people who are working for a dollar. But thats just it, I was not looking for a gem.

Yes I would like to get the higher return from the get go, and if odesk would have proper screening methods perhaps I could do that, however when all the $1.00 articler writers tell me that they have perfect english and no grammer errors, their are issues.

Now if I were to increase it too x amount and fill in X. I still would be getting not only the better applications but also i would get all the $1.00 applications as well, and now how do i screen that.

Keep in mind that I dont have the ability to determine what is a good article vs a great article.

People dont deserve anything, they work for it and they earn their $20 per article. I am glad that they do,

Now I get it.

Rachelle S. wrote:

I dont need an editor. I do not publish any of my own work.
No very few of the articles are gems. Do you really think your going to get a lot of gems when your paying $1.00 per article.

I think you have too high expectations of people who are working for a dollar. But thats just it, I was not looking for a gem.

Yes I would like to get the higher return from the get go, and if odesk would have proper screening methods perhaps I could do that, however when all the $1.00 articler writers tell me that they have perfect english and no grammer errors, their are issues.

Now if I were to increase it too x amount and fill in X. I still would be getting not only the better applications but also i would get all the $1.00 applications as well, and now how do i screen that.

Keep in mind that I dont have the ability to determine what is a good article vs a great article.

People dont deserve anything, they work for it and they earn their $20 per article. I am glad that they do,

She's a farmer. She doesn't publish this stuff, she resells it for probably a lot more than she's paying. So, not only is she buying drivel, she's SELLING drivel. Lovely.

Rachelle, I'll tell you how you screen the $1 writers from the $25 writers. You read their portfolios and you look for people with published bylines.

If you can't tell a decent writer from a crap writer by reading, you're in the wrong business. Someone at one point sold you a bill of goods by telling you that you could make a fortune online by sitting on your ass and paying $1 an article for SEO-driven crapola. Instead of trying to figure out where you've screwed up, you're still insisting on believing that. If you're not "looking for a gem," you're a lousy businesswoman.

Keep going that way. See how long it lasts.

Cate The issue is not

Cate
The issue is not tellig the difference between the $1.00 writer and the $25.00 writer, other then the amount of time it takes. But rather it is telling the difference between the $10, $15, $20 dollar writers and the $25 dollar writer.

Cate why do you keep on making assumptions. Instead of making statements that are not true, why dont you be a good writer and ask questions before you write the statement.

No where did i ever say that I could make a fortune online by sitting on my ass and paying $1.00 for an article. We have a long thread here and please point out too me where I said anything like that.

You're right.

Rachelle S. wrote:
Cate

No where did i ever say that I could make a fortune online by sitting on my ass and paying $1.00 for an article. We have a long thread here and please point out too me where I said anything like that.

True. You didn't SAY that. But everything else you've said IMPLIES that.

I'm done.

You're a farmer (a dirty word to most professional writers) who buys cheap work from "artical writters" and doesn't have the wherewithal to know why she isn't making as much of her rather-muddy money than she has in the past.

And when she asks why, she doesn't have the sense to listen to those who DO make money at this. Keep up with this business model. I love it when farmers go out of business.

Cate So you would

Cate
So you would classifiy someone who is writing an article For $1.00
as an Artical writer?

I never asked about why it was not making money. I am quite aware of that aspect of the game. I am also not complaining about it at all, eve if it appears that I am.
As i said I have no problem with the writers making more then I can pay them
it means that I have done my job. You Cate have you methods to help people increase their wages and I have mine.

really

I have to jump in here.

"Cate why do you keep on making assumptions. Instead of making statements that are not true, why dont you be a good writer and ask questions before you write the statement."

Cate knows what she is doing. She is a great writer. Have you ever looked at her profile? Yes she can be blunt at times, but I have seen many threads and many posts where she gives great advice to other contractors.

I am not saying she is not a

I am not saying she is not a great writer. What I am asking is that rather then making assumptions , just ask me. If i dont want too tell you I will say so.

If somebody has a 5 star

If somebody has a 5 star profile with lots of feedback from jobs around the $20/hour (or whatever) mark you can be very confident they will consistently deliver quality pieces for that pay bracket. It ain't rocket science.

Of course having 5 star

Of course having 5 star feedback is better then having 1 star feedback. And depending on the needs those with the five stae feedback from a various sources will often get the first look.

The problem is that based upon this theory that if everyone would only hire those who have five star feedback then no new contractor could ever get a job.

There's no problem with that

There's no problem with that 'theory' at all. We all started on 0 stars, myself included.

I fail to see how that is relevant anyway. If you want to be confident of hiring somebody that will deliver their profile should tell you all you need to know. Otherwise what would be the point having a profile at all?

Jamie Thats is the problem.

Jamie
Thats is the problem. The profile does not tell you, Yes it can help at time
but their are too many people on odesk who have , can we padded profiles that it makes it very hard for people too weed out the good from the bad.

Now if odesk had a true testing method, then yes that could solve some of the problems but they do not, nor have I heard of any plans on getting ture testing. True testing is the following.

You say you have amazing grammer. Fine you go to a test center you show proper ID that matches your ID on the odesk system. You take a test in an offical testing taking center and they then confirm that you in deed took the test and got this score.

You say your a good writer and you have perfect grammer and english, same thing you go to a center and you write an article and its judge by real editors who have a byline and they confirm that yes so and so wrote this work on such and such day at our center.

Now if odesk would do that, then that would make the profile mean something.

To answer your question i do not think you can write a indepth article at a center as you need to do research and everything, however you can write a piece of general infomation a test center. I know you can as I had too do it at college.

Means nothing?

Rachelle S. wrote:

Now if odesk would do that, then that would make the profile mean something.

So you think you could have a worker in any field, charging a particular rate, consistently getting high scores and excellent feedback from a large number of clients....... yet this means nothing?

Jamie No I never said that.

Jamie
No I never said that. A worker in any field that is consistently getting high scores and real feedback means a lot.

I am now talking about those workers who do not have a feedback history, or those who had a feedback history which for what ever reason is not 5 star or even 4 star.

What about them?

Rachelle S. wrote:

I am now talking about those workers who do not have a feedback history, or those who had a feedback history which for what ever reason is not 5 star or even 4 star.

What about them?

It is those workers who are

It is those workers who are harder to judge and who will often
agree to work for $1.00 per article, i have yet too meet a worker who has made $20 in the past willing to work for $1.00 or even $12.00 .

Eh?

So let me get this right...

You want oDesk to implement a more stringent testing system where candidates are tested more rigorously. You want this done so you can more easily identify good quality writers to make it easier for you to choose who to hire at $1/hour.

Do I have that right?

No you do not have that

No you do not have that right.

I want odesk too have a more rigorous system so I can feel comfortable paying $15+ an hour and know that im getting good quality writers.

I pay $1.00 per article is often $1.00 per hour because odesk does not have a system in place.

Uh?

We're back at square one again.

If somebody's profile shows they consistently perform well when charging $15/hour, why would you not feel comfortable?

I can't be the only one that's confused.

We are not talking about the

We are not talking about the worker who has a record on odesk. I am talking about those who do not have a feedback record on odesk.

?

Why not just choose those that do have records on oDesk then? There's plenty at that level. Do you think you are somehow obliged to employ somebody even if you are not confident in them?

So lets use Kants wisdom

So lets use Kants wisdom here. If everyone were to follow that logic
then no new worker would ever get a job.

?

You are taking a very simple thing and making it much more difficult than it needs to be.

Why should other people getting their oDesk profile started be any concern of yours? If other people are willing to give them a chance then great, but you don't have to if you don't want to. If you feel comfortable in hiring somebody then hire them and if you don't, then don't. It really, really is that simple.

As I have already said EVERYBODY that works on oDesk started with NO feedback whatsoever.

Jamie...

Give it a break. She's clueless. It's not worth your time, your trouble, or your correct usage of "their, they're, your, and you're." Wink

Ha ha

your write their

Correction:

You forgot "to" and "too".

You are correct, but someone

You are correct, but someone has too give them that first chance.
Which is why I hire writers for $1.00 per article it gives them their first chance.
Why should other people be a concern of mine , because a) It helps them get a chance to start a career b) It is good for me, as it creates more supply.
when Supply is more the demand the prices go down.
When demand is more then supply then prices go up.

Its called the law of Supply and demand.

I give up

Rachelle S. wrote:

Why should other people be a concern of mine

Do me a favour and quit pretending to "do those people a favour" - It's beginning to make me physically sick.

I give up. You clearly have no sense of right or wrong.

Therefor it is entirely pointless to have a conversation about *this* matter with you. It's like trying to discuss astro-physics with a cheese-burger.

As I said before. You are

As I said before. You are right , I was not doing anyone a favour.
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