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Should I accept jobs under "Active Candidacy" status?

Fellow contractors,
I need your honest opinion. A client has already asked me to write several articles even though he hasn't hired me yet. My status with him is still Active Candidacy. The term is Fixed price. Should you guys think I start writing articles for him. He said if the final client (i guess, the client i'm communicating with right now is a mediator or something) will not agree with the article, I may or may not get paid. So it left me wondering, how would i know if his client accepts or disapproves my article?? I do not even have the final client's contact so I may also be informed.
Please enlighten me...

Vote Result

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Score: 1.5, Votes: 2
good grief. listen to

good grief. listen to yourself: if he hasn't hired you yet, why on earth would you even think of starting work??

your "client" isn't a mediator, he's called a "farmer". do a search in the forums and you'll know what that means. Wink

of course you wouldn't know whether or not his "client" approves of your articles, you're not dealing with him (the real client) directly.

the way i look at it. you're only opening yourself to getting scammed.

"If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude. Don't complain." - Maya Angelou
Try harder, or care less.

Even in the "Brick and Mortar

Even in the "Brick and Mortar world" you don't start work until you get to sign a contract and or an appointment letter.

Junelle is right, listen to her...

Unless, your feeling Charitable? Smile

Gay, writing one article is

Gay, writing one article is enough as an active candidate. If you're being ask to do several articles then that's free work. As long as there's no contract then you know the obvious. Don't give an impression to the client that you're desperate to get a job because you'll be prone to abuse if you allow yourself to.

Interesting limit there:

Francisco F. wrote:
writing one article is enough as an active candidate. If you're being ask to do several articles then that's free work.

So, one article is fine. That is not free? But more than one is doing free work?

Sometimes, I wish I could use the same calculator other people use. I just don't get how things add up at times. I always do this kind of math as such:

I-didn't-receive-pay-for-the-work + any-other-factor = Free Work.

That's Charity for you!

Laughing out loud That's Charity for you! Laughing out loud

BTW, how long should a free article be? xxx words?

If the one article was done

If the one article was done from a previous work or for that interview, just make it clear that the copyright does not belong to the client, so it's not free. The calculator adds up correctly. Smile

"from a previous work?"

Francisco F. wrote:
If the one article was done from a previous work

I hope you don't suggest handing over articles done for other clients without their permission? You can not use what someone else paid you for without their permission, as you do not own it.

Plus, the OP wasn't talking about "handing over recycled work." He was talking about writing articles during the interview stages.

"Just make it clear that the

"Just make it clear that the copyright does not belong to the client, so it's not free. "

Best you are aware that this tactic seldom works, largely because only wealthy idiots spend lawyers fees following up on small amounts of stolen work. When articles are stolen, the best you can do is publish those articles elsewhere to ruin their SEO scores.

Relying on copyright assertions is the equivalent of wearing a sign around your neck stating that the valuables you're carrying belong solely to you. Doesn't really prevent muggings, does it?

It's not quite like that

Kirsten Holmes wrote:
"Just make it clear that the copyright does not belong to the client, so it's not free. "

Best you are aware that this tactic seldom works, largely because only wealthy idiots spend lawyers fees following up on small amounts of stolen work. When articles are stolen, the best you can do is publish those articles elsewhere to ruin their SEO scores

Well, Once a stolen article has been published publishing it again actually ruins the "SEO score" of the LATER article, because it would appear to be the copy... NOT the one that has been published first. And it's not the only thing that can be done. It is actually quite simple to report stolen work on the internet, no need for lawyers.

The better tactic would be to not write a custom sample and then hand it over to the client, but to write it, publish it (in a blog or whatever) and then send the client a link. That way the client gets their sample to see if the work is to his or her liking, but can't do anything with it.

Should the client want to buy it they can, and it can be deleted. If the client doesn't it's there, it's "protected" and it can be used as sample work in any way the contractor wishes.

but, I don't know the bot's schedule

Petra R.][quote=Kirsten Holmes wrote:
Should the client want to buy it they can, and it can be deleted. If the client doesn't it's there, it's "protected" and it can be used as sample work in any way the contractor wishes.

I agree that this sounds like a good solution, but 'publishing' means opening it up to be indexed by search bots, which can take forever to index a page or take no time at all. At least, that is how I understand it.

If it is published, it is published, and the value goes to the site that it was first indexed on. As far as search goes, that is.

I do agree with everything else. Particularly, that stolen work is taken seriously and can be reported (not just to oDesk). I don't think that is a good reason to do it, but there is recourse if it is stolen, and it does not cost thousands to report it.

(I have had no caffeine and am discussing indexing bots. if this utterly lacks logic, I apologize. Please look closely. I believe there is a smidgen here somewhere.)

DO NOT do as Francisco is suggesting.

Francisco F. wrote:
If the one article was done from a previous work or for that interview, just make it clear that the copyright does not belong to the client, so it's not free. The calculator adds up correctly. :)

While you can present previously published work as a sample of how you would do the job in question, giving it to the new client is the same as stealing it from your old client. Also, writing something specific to the new job, when you haven't been hired, is ALSO giving your work away for free.

Use your head here.

If the client wants you to work, get an upfront payment and a contract in place BEFORE you start giving away anything.

Petra, if you go through

Petra, if you go through google's webmaster blog properly, you will see that a second publication of duplicate content will dilute both articles' keywords in many instances. When one site is syndicating content,the websites have to be structured in a specific way to prevent that from happening.

I would like to know about

I would like to know about this easy way to report stolen work. Ultimately, you might report stolen content to Google. In theory, that sounds viable but in practice it is not always so simple. They themselves admit that they struggle to stay on top of their support issues.

Perhaps you could report it to the hosting company. Here, the content may be removed only to pop up elsewhere. Take into consideration how difficult it has been to remove certain criminal rings from the web: they just pop up in several more places. It has been a good decade since servers have been trying to rid the internet of pro-anorexia web rings managed by your ordinary adolescent down the road--and they still haven't managed to succeed, even with sites that they've been working on for years.

If I report content theft, the situation is my word against theirs and they are going to lie. Unless I can prove that the content was written by me, there is little recourse that I can see. The type of companies that are willing to steal content are also the type of companies that are likely to employ underhanded techniques to retain the benefit of what they have stolen. I think we have enough examples of how servers have failed to combat mirror sites and so forth.

too much credit to these clients

I doubt that many, if any, of the clients that we deal with are in league with the ones you are talking about. We deal with small time crooks and "entrepooers" who think they are on to something with this steeling because of some advice they have been given or something.

It is not hard to prove authorship of work, and Google does take it seriously. These long time nemeses have nothing to do with that. If the client is a hard core thief that does not learn, you are talking a different game there.

Gay, I saw your profile and

Gay,

I saw your profile and it appears you're a newbie. Just like a new food product being introduced in the market, the company selling it gives out FREE samples to the market to test. You see them in malls.

In the same way, you have to show a sample of your work to your client/market.

Those who comment otherwise may already have work feedback histories. That's why they comment that way.

But I'm sure they gave samples when they started out their writing careers.

not me.

Francisco F. wrote:
...
But I'm sure they gave samples when they started out their writing careers.

not me. i *never* gave out samples when i started. i always put everything in my blog, and let the clients view them there. publishing an article where it can be seen by *everyone* - not just one client - isn't the same as giving away a free sample. it's called "developing a portfolio."

no idea where you got your information, or why you're so sure.

"If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude. Don't complain." - Maya Angelou
Try harder, or care less.

A blog is a way of showing

A blog is a way of showing samples.

Samples are not the same as

Samples are not the same as portfolio items. I have never offered a free sample. My first published article was a column that I sent out as an unsolicited piece, for which I was paid. Thereafter, I began to receive commissions and that was that. Portfolio pieces are helpful, and if there is no portfolio, it is beneficial to create one. That is quite the opposite of writing a 500 word article about the client's requested topic, using his listed keywords and supported by citations and images.

exactly. showing samples, but

exactly. showing samples, but not "giving them away".

Francisco F. wrote:
But I'm sure they gave samples when they started out their writing careers.

"If you don't like something, change it. If you can't change it, change your attitude. Don't complain." - Maya Angelou
Try harder, or care less.

NEVER

Francisco F. wrote:
But I'm sure they gave samples when they started out their writing careers.

I cannot believe you are suggesting such a thing or encouraging this behavior. This is how so many newbies get scammed.

We don't get work feedback histories by working for free. The client has to pay to leave a review.

I have one class assignment from college posted in my profile. If that is not enough, I completely understand, but I will not produce something tailored to a non-paying, maybe client who can see I can write. I have NEVER given anything away for free or engaged in a conversation with a client about such. That is a deal breaker and I prefer it when it is indicated in the job post so I know right away to pass by.

What are you thinking? You custom tailored words ARE NOT POTATO CHIPS!!!!

.

.

Francisco, 1st of all read

Francisco,

1st of all read the O.P's post again, she was talking about starting to work(by writing articles)even not yet being hired. She was not referring to Samples in any way.

And there is a big difference between Free Show and Free handouts. So directing your potential client to your Own Legitimate Blog, Works or publication to show how good or bad you are, are miles away in comparison to creating a product(articles are products too) and giving them away for free.

Absolutely NOT!

Francisco F. wrote:
Gay,

But I'm sure they gave samples when they started out their writing careers.

I was smart enough to do my research by questioning successful freelancers and finding out how to make the system work for me without resorting to selling myself -- or my product -- cheap. And I NEVER give anything away for free!

no. and please report the

no. and please report the client.

said this many times..hahah

I said this message just minutes ago. This kind of schemes, scenarios and employers? Work only WITH A CONTRACT! Also, fix-priced is not guaranteed payment. I assume you have read this before you applied for a fixed priced contract:

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You are applying for a Fixed Price project. While the majority of oDesk projects end successfully, please keep a few things in mind:

1. Payment is not guaranteed on Fixed Price Jobs.
oDesk only guarantees payment on Hourly Jobs.

2. The client decides whether to pay and how much to pay.
Before you start the project, you and the client must agree to requirements and a budget. Once the work is done, the client has full discretion over whether to pay and how much to pay. oDesk verifies the client's credit card at the beginning of the project, though we do not hold the money in escrow.

3.oDesk does not offer mediation or arbitration services.
If you do the work and the client refuses to pay, oDesk will not be able to help.

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Well, that summarizes everything I wanted to say. Hope this helps.